winchester model 12 simmons rib
becouse plain barrels shoot higher than solid ribs do ,solid ribs shoot flatter. The new 1935-style buttstock featured a closer and fuller pistol grip. Condition: excellent bright bore, 98% blue overall thinn, Winchester Model 12. Buy 1955 Winchester Model 12 20 GA Simmons Rib AA+ Wood: GunBroker is the largest seller of Pump Action Shotguns Shotguns Guns & Firearms All: 974012213. Askins Ithaca 10-gauge double with 2 7/8-inch chambers averaged 86.9% with 1 5/8-ounces of shot. Along in the 1920s a few bold souls had long-chambered [3-inch], overbored, long-barreled, and heavy, long range 12-gauge Magnum double guns built. The finishes and rib are 100% Winchester and in great condi, Used Winchester Model 12 20 Gauge 26" barrel WS-1choked skeet Cutts compensator with restriction inserts good condition Buyer pays shipping Millers Gun Center Located in New, Winchester Model 12 pump action 12ga shotgun. w/ 22" barrel in original box w/ paperwork 1 of 1,000 #UG5 2 Paul Jaeger Jenkintown, PA. 30-06 cal. There are currently no customer product questions on this lot. Charles Askins was the leading expert on shotguns in the first half of the last century. Western rapidly achieved a leading position in the ammunition industry through innovation and skillful management. I RATE THE BLUING AT 98% AND THE WOOD AT 96+%. When I dress Western, nothing beats the classic good looks of my Smith & Wesson (S&W) 586 .357 revolver. Probably a lot farther than we can hit em. My name is Chuck 620 515 0556. The magnum led to new class of long-range double-barrel shotguns for waterfowl. Houze relates that for the Model 12 the Watrous report suggested improve the smoothness of the action as it is criticized for being rough. How this was to be accomplished is not related but closer hand-fitting and gauging of parts was likely. I have the wood all refinished. I have a donut post trap gun but not a pigeon, had two 3 inch guns, one had donut post the other had a round post. Askins and Buckingham would sure be surprised at how far the 12 magnum has come. to be finishedat least thats what Stadt says in his book"Winchester, Shotguns and Shotshells"very interesting book.a little different look at M-12 than Madis and Riffle.WC. I believe that Stadt's book is one of the few that actually states that Winchester did produce M42s with Winchester vent ribs. The 12 month average price is $622.51 new and $661.18 used. In duck shooting the proportion of magazine guns in use is much higher, probably four men in five using the repeater. Askins added, Fact is, personally, I have always thought that I was surer on the second bird with a repeater than I was with a double gun. On gauges for duck hunting: No fault is to be found with the twelve [gauge] as a duck gun, whether in double barrel with 3 inch cases or in repeaters with 2 3/4 inch. a post would have spent 281.5 hours trying to correct off handed remarks as a expert about winchester model 12's & 42's. Winchester - Model 12 Factory Try-Gun, 12ga, 30" Barrel. Model 12 duck guns had the same six-shot capacity as the standard Model 12: one in the chamber, five in the magazine. John Olin initiated an analysis of Winchesters commercial line in 1942. Nash Buckingham was one of the great duck-hunting writers of the period. I don't believe their ever was a royalty, actually Simmons kept selling his special vent rib model 12's after the 1955 introduction of the Winchester Special Vent Rib @ New Haven. For more information: www.p65warnings.ca.gov. Winchester cautiously claimed 70 to 75% pattern in a 30 inch circle at 40 yards.. The solid rib gun shows carrying wear while the ventilated rib gun was refinished when the rib was installed. Its been debated over the years if the solid rib model 12 barrel were silver brazed or fused with heat? Get the 76th edition of the World's Greatest Gun Book. Beautifully figured wood is solid with only light handling marks and marks on bo, This Winchester Model 12 started life in 1924 and has been customized by unknown individual at some point. - Top Rated Plus - opens in a new window or tab, - eBay Money Back Guarantee - opens in a new window or tab. Buttstocks of duck guns had lead slugs inserted into the wood beneath the recoil pad. 12 Gauge, For sale is the Winchester Model 12. Full choke was the only standard boring available. Winchester proof steel replaced nickel steel in the manufacture of all Winchester firearms in the early 1930s. Second Media Corp., 111 Peter Street, Suite 600, Toronto, Ontario, M5V 2H1, Canada. The standard 12-gauge duck load in 1921 was a 2 3/4-inch shell holding 3 3/4-drams equivalent powder and 1 1/4-ounces of shot. It is general consensus that 10 patterns are required for an accurate appraisal of a given load and barrel combination. Guns.com pledges to make gun buying easy, to support local gun stores, and to serve our There are 3 possible models that you might have: 1) Your Model 12 has a grooved slide handle and with a 'F' stamped after the serial number and has a lightweight alloy trigger guard. The buttstock was reshaped on Model 12 shotguns again in the mid-1950s. Popularly named the Perfect Repeater at its introduction, it largely set the standard for pump action shotguns over its 51-year high-rate production life. Chamber marked 3", choke marked full, and 14 1/2" LOP. Great communications. Looks to me a bit like the raised rib on a Lutjic one barrel trap gun- and the 870- well, Rudy Etchen shot a 12 gauge 870 Trap Grade he got new in 1950-I'd like to have a C-note for every clay bird, box pigeon and game bird he shattered with that old Remmie- I could move in next to Bill Gates- or maybe his gardener!! Most everything can be easily bought online these days. The era of the double gun was ending as World War II approached. Shopping at Guns.com gives you the backing I was at a local gunshop this morning and was looking at a model 12 2-3/4" that had a Simmons rib. On the other hand, a duck caught in the middle of one of these dense-centered pattern sat 40 yards would receive a dozen or more pellets. I have owned a Pigeon grade model 12 trap Dounut vent rib, built late 1955, now that's an oddity, who would order a Pigeon Trap with a Dounut Rib (?) Initially came a series of auto-loading rifles, including the rimfire Model 1903 and centerfire rifles, culminating with the Model 1910, chambered for the 401 WSL cartridge. A forum community dedicated to Trap shooting enthusiasts. Refresh your browser window to try again. We have a Mechanically excellent. , Excellent Winchester Model 12 12 gauge Deluxe Skeet gun with factory issued Cutts Compensator. is 14" with pad. These are rare, a line can be seen along the dounut post on both sides. You jack the shell out and it goes off under your nose. The 1 5/8-ounce load of the mid-30s bought the 12 magnum a few more yards of range. A 2pin vent rib lets the shooter sight under the bird and keep the bird in sight. very accurate description and fast delivery, HOCH Reloading Single Cavity Mold c56 309170 .309 170gr nose pour NICE (#334593408927), Arrived quickly, well packaged, item is as described. JavaScript is disabled. 30 Barrel. Buckingham had a solid 60-yard duck gun and was on his way to becoming a legend. This gives a wrinkled appearance on bottom of pistol grip and bottom of forend. My wife shot her share of ducks with a 20-gauge autoloader bored Improved Cylinder shooting one ounce of #7 1/2-shot. THE SHOT GUN IS IN VERY GOOD CONDITION , WITH A 28 IN VENTILATED RIB BARREL WITH FULL CHOKE. . FORE ARM HAS A PEICE OF WOOD MI, This is an all original 1962 made Winchester Model 12 in the harder to find 16 Gauge. H. Lea Lawrence relates in his 2001 GUN DIGEST article, The Saga of Bo Whoop, that in 1921 John Olin sent Buckingham his personal heavy double, a custom-choked Super Fox, for testing. Winchester Model 12 Shotguns For Sale Shotgun Winchester Model 12. I was in Jr college then. Must ship to an FFL. It is the skeet style of stock with a comb drop of 1 1/2 2 1/2 inches, and a 14-inch length, butt to trigger. I put one of those BIG soft foam risers on the comb and shot it that way for years. But the charm of idle jump-shooting is far too potent.. bolt act. To elaborate on lowgun's response, the "round post" rib was made by Simmons, not Winchester. Original appearing donut post and round post vent rib Model 12s with no Simmons markings and proof marks in the proper places are generally thought by collectors to have been made to completion in the Winchester factory. THIS SHOTGUN WAS A LIMITED RUN OF 4000 MADE BETWEEN 93-95. The balance point is the takedown joint. Beautiful grain pattern and very tight hand checkering on the stock . on your local stores shelf, most retailers drop ship it from a warehouse in Item . Contact us if you need an add on vent rib for your shotgun or order your Simmons ventilated rib barrel today! Alarm calls! It was John Olin who inspired Westerns revolutionary Super-Xshotshell in 1921. RIAC believes that this website is accessible to the widest possible audience pursuant to the guidelines of the Americans with Disability Act. The famous Winchester Model 1912 pump shotgun was designed by Winchester's Thomas C. Johnson. The Model 12 was the first magazine repeater chambered for 3-inch magnum shells. Free Shipping, No Credit Card Fees. Epic 22 Pocket Pistol: The Beretta 71 Jaguar. Guns.com is built to be simple easily organized products, useful descriptions from experts, and support to guide you to the right choice. Ernie Simmons had a close relationship with Winchester & John Olin; if you find any NSSA ,ATA, Field & Stream and Sports Afield magazines pre-war and post war you'll find he sold plenty of Winchesters out of his gun shop and attended many shoots selling target guns. Chamber marked 2 3/4", choke marked full, and 14" LOP. Length of pull was reduced in January 1936 to reflect the extra clothing worn by duck hunters. No Reserve. I have often wondered how well my guns would pattern with modern ammunition. Winchester Model 12 16 ga NIB Never Assembled! The old trap shooters didn't and they did just fine. Action works very nicely. Patterns were fired from a benchrest, using American Target Company B21 silhouette targets measuring 35 by 45 inches. An offset proof mark will boost the value compared to an aftermarket rib. Remington re-tooled from the M31 to the stamp, push and press 870 which sold for less than the M12. Their attitude is summed up by Elmer Keith in Shotguns by Keith: the satisfaction of seeing big ducks crumple at long range and come down and bounce on the ground or splash high in the water is the cream of shotgun shooting., It is my view that the long-range duck-hunting cult was a legacy from the days of market hunting. The receiver is heavier and so is the barrel. L.O.P. 2. Charles Askins confirmed the tighter patterns and greater effective range in the field. 31 12 ga. pump shotgun w/ Simmons ventilated rib - walnut checkered stock & forearm - & 30" These are rare, a line can be seen along the dounut post on both sides. Original appearing donut post and round post vent rib Model 12s with no Simmons markings and proof marks in the proper places are generally thought by collectors to have been made to completion in the Winchester factory. It won't be a collector but a shooter and should draw some attention. Down pitch remained 2-1/2 inches with the 30-inch barrel throughout production. The Duck Stamp Law of 1934 was enacted to provide funds for waterfowl propagation. I recently acquired a 1921 gun. Will Winchester ever build the Model 12 again? Yes the 2-pin milled rib was costly to manufacture. The straighter stock reduced perceived recoil. The gun looked to be in excellent condition except some nitwit had inlayed a white plastic diamond in the stock at some point. Both shotguns shot to point of aim and all patterns were contained on the target paper due to precise aiming, facilitated by placing a 25-pound sack of lead shot between me and the gun butt. The stock finish is original and excellent. Pandemonium! Pattern percentages were around 70% with these latter loads. The Olins bought Winchester for $8.1 million through a combination of $3.3 million cash and the balance in an issue of preferred stock. Edwin Pugsley, in charge of Winchester at the time of receivership, is quoted in Williamsons book: The purchase of the company by the Olin interests brought a breath of life to the institution and brought to Winchester many things. Find many great new & used options and get the best deals for Winchester Model 12 12 ga 30 in Barrel 2 3/4" Full vent rib Barrel NICE! Winchester Model 42 Slide Action Shotgun with Simmons Vent RibManufactured in 1952. Regards Chuck. Standard Grade: 12-, 16-, 20- and 28-gauge; plain, solid or ventilated rib round barrels; standard lengths 26", 28", 30", 32"; plain walnut pistol-grip stock; grooved slide handle. I believe the solid ribs were soft (lead) soldered like the model 21's. This Model 12 has Serial Number 1391884 was produced in 1953. . 1 9-16" DAC, 1 9-16" DAH, 14 1/2, Very good plus overall condition. The original "Old milled rib" was developed by Winchester in the 1920's- but like so many of the older quality features, post WW11 competition by Remington and Ithaca made Olin-Winchester more "cost concerned"-- Many Model 12's were equipped with Simmons ribs afterwards, some were sent to New Haven by Simmons, and some Model 12's (and others . And our The drop at heel was reduced from 2-1/2 to 2-3/8 inches in December 1938. Reduced bag limits and shell capacities for repeating shotguns were introduced. Two birds tumble all awry from among the leaders. I always wondered what the royalty was to Simmons on the Winchester Special Ventilated Rib that they installed. The 12-gauge 3-inch magnum shotshell was developed to achieve this objective. Buy a Winchester Model 12 12ga., 30-inch Full choke, Simmons ventilated rib; this gun was made in 1941 (se for sale by Vintage Sporting on GunsAmerica.com the best online marketplace for buying and selling semi auto pistols, firearms, accessories, and collectibles : 963027340 Sold them when we down sized to a smaller house that did not have a custom built safe room in it like the old house. during that time I handled many M-12's of varying configurations. restrictions refer to: http://www.copyright.gov/laws/ - doublegunshop.com will not monitor nor will they be held liable for copyright violations presented on the BBS which is an open and un-moderated public forum. Generally, a Simmons rib gun will bring a higher price than a plain barrel gun, and a lower price than a solid rib or Winchester vent rib gun, all other factors being equal. It is in excellent condition with only light handing marks, Used Browning BT99 Plus 12 gauge 28" bbl fixed choke mod good condition no box no manuals Buyer pays shipping Millers Gun Center Located in New Castle, Delaware "Home of TAX, WINCHESTER MODEL 12 16GA PUMP ACTION SHOTGUN, 26" BBL, 2 3/4, POLY CHOKE, RIBLESS, EJECTORS, SINGLE TRIGGER, MEDIUM DARK FIGURED WALNUT, PISTOL GRIP, LOP 14 3/8, 1 1/2, 2 5/16, 7LBS 3OZ, 985 BLUE, Winchester. The price $379 does not seem out of line for model 12's in this area; however, my question is does the Simmons rib add or detract from the value of the gun? I am planning on shooting it at the Grand Nostalgia shoot. Powered by UBB.threads PHP Forum Software 7.7.5. Such were the men of the long-range duck-hunting cult. This fine shotgun comes from the factory with a Cutts choke system, Metal surfaces rate near excellent, handling marks to wood. Johnson, at once one of the great gun designers and one of the least known, produced a steady flow of new firearm designs for Winchester. Also, the rib and its receiver extension cover the Winchester proof marks, a sure sign that it is not factory installed. The Olins soon added to the attractiveness of the Model 12 duck gun by bringing out a new 1 5/8-ounce load for the 3-inch shell. The 30" heavy barrel is proof stamped "WINCHESTER TRADE MARK MADE IN THE U.S.A."; "-MODEL 12 - 12 GA. - FULL"; "WINCHESTER PROOF STEEL"; "FOR SUPER SPEED & SUPER - X 3 IN.". Notes - Delivery *Estimated delivery dates include seller's handling time, origin ZIP Code, destination ZIP Code and time of acceptance and will depend on shipping service selected and receipt of cleared payment. Charles Askins commented on the new Model 12 duck gun in the March 1936 issue of Outdoor Life: This should be the best long-range repeating shotgun now made or that has been made. No faint praise, but hardly a surprise. Many online gun sales actually take away from your local Also available initially were standard trap and special trap grades. It is at my engraver now. generous return policy, and handle everything you dont have to go back to The committee appointed to study the requirements for continuing business reported a successful reorganization would require the raising of a substantial amount of new capital. That capital was supplied by the Olin family of Olin Industries, owners of Western Cartridge Company. It is first shooting light. another state. Elmer Keith instructs:For the man who wants greater range and a bigger shot load for duck or goose shooting, the Model 12 Winchester is in a class by itself [with] the long 3 load. Nevertheless, the 1 7/8-ounce load appeared in the mid-50s and now a full two ounces of shot can be had in the 12 magnum. The price in 1963 was $122 compared to $109.50 for the standard Model 12. prior written consent of the Copyright holder. These were called long-range waterfowl guns.. As to price, it will also depend on gauge, barrel length, choke, barrel steel, wood type, pad vs. plate, etc. It has a Simmons rib, which is not out of the question for Winchester to have used according to Maddis in his book of the model 12's. The metal finish is superior to a field grade gun, higher polish and a matted receiver top and magazine tube. at the best online prices at eBay! Model 12 Skeet Pump Shotgun. McIntosh notes that the Super-X shotshell was a breakthrough to the modern age of shotgun ammunition. In a full-page ad in the September 1926 issue of the American Rifleman, Western claimed Killing power 15 to 20 yards beyond the effective range of ordinary loads.This was based on a documented reduction in stringing of the shot charge, from about 20 feet to about 4 feet, at 42 yards. 26" Vent Rib Barrels Choked SKEET. Dolphin, I agree with you until the part where you imply that Model 12s were sent to Simmons for ribs and then sent back to Winchester to sell. Winchester Pre War Mod 12 Trap 2 Barrel Set 12ga, Winchester Pre 64 Mod 12 DU Illinios No.1 Engraved by M Dubber, WINCHESTER MODEL 12 HEAVY DUCK 12GA 3 INCH MAGNUM, Winchester Model 12 16 Gauge rare 2-barrel set, Used Browning BT99 Plus 12 gauge 28" bbl fixed choke mod good condition no box no manuals, WINCHESTER MODEL 12 16GA PUMP ACTION SHOTGUN, Winchester Mod 12 Vent Rib B-Carved Wood 12ga, "Winchester Model 12 Shotgun 12 Gauge (W12258), Winchester, Ducks Unlimited, Model 12, 12 Ga, Shotgun, Winchester Model 21 Heavy Duck, 12ga, 30" 3" mag, Briley Chokes, Winchester Model 12 12 ga. Deluxe Skeet grade w/ factory Cutts, Winchester Model 1912 Nickel Steel 20 gauge 24" VR bbl EARLY Serial #. Simmons Gun Specialties rib has been added to barrel. The trap load was included because trap shooting is suited to the duck gun. Thought behind it was that a taller rib on the bbl and a higher comb on the stock would help prevent "head lifting". The lead slug added weight but more importantly maintained the balance point at the takedown joint. Cred, Ser no 510553, Mfg 1928 , Numbers Match, 30" Donut Post Vent Rib that is stamped Imp Cyl but has been relined and is Mod, 2nd barrel is 30" Donut Post Vent Rib stamped full but is Mod, Stamp, This Winchester Model 12 was manufactured in 1955 and is in good condition for its age. Bluing is in overall very good condition. Did they actually produce any in 1919 or did it take some time to get them out to the public after patent was approved? Winchester Model 12 Takedown Slide Action Shotgun with Simmons Ventilated RibProduced in 1961. I was glad to see this as I know for a fact that while many weren't done, they did indeed do some. Free Shipping, No Credit Card Fees. Alex, we don't have enough info to give you an informed opinion. Saint Charles, Missouri. . In an ad in the October 1952 American Rifleman, Winchester proclaimed. Mar 24, 2023 Winchester Model 12 Shotgun $150 Mar 24, 2023 Two Winchester Pump Shotguns $150 Mar 24, 2023 L.C. That is true about Model 42s, but, as far as researchers know, it is not true about Model 12s. MAKE OFFER. 1 Winchester Model 70 Ultra Grade Featherweight 270 Win. Winchester Model 12 28 Gauge (W9229) Price: $3,250.00 Item Number: W9229 Previously sold Winchester Model 12 28 Gauge shotgun. No Reserve . Both guns have 30-inch Full choke barrels inscribed FOR SUPER SPEED & SUPER-X 3 IN. The bores are bright with no pitting. For small bores, there are still new factory wood sets available. organized, dont tell you a lot about what youre buying, and leave you on your A lot of us will have to begin learning to hit long-range ducks. Sounds like an invitation to join the long-range duck hunting cult! 1934 skeet grade offerd. "Metal parts of the Model 12 are machined from chrome-molybdenum, the toughest, longest wearing and finest gun steel known." Barrel lengths were 30 or 32 inches, but 32-inch barrels were discontinued in 1948. Checkered semi-fancy walnut pistol grip stock with extended forearm and a solid Winchester recoil pad. In an ad in the October 1952 American Rifleman, Winchester proclaimed. We'rebringing a level of Winchester suggests their 3-inch 12-gauge shotshells with 1 3/8-ounces or 1 5/8-ounces of #4 shot for wildfowl hunting in their 1951 Ammunition Handbook: These shells were developed especially for extremes in long range shooting with 12-gauge Winchester Model 12 and Model 21 Heavy Duck Guns.. Simmons vent rib and custom AA+ walnut furniture. Introduced in 20 gauge in 1912, 16 and 12 gauge guns followed in 1914. winchester model 12 description: for sale is a very nice vintage winchester model 12, 12ga ga shotgun. Chamber marked 2 3/4", choke marked full, and 13 1/8" LOP. Askins rule of thumb of 70 years ago still pertains with modern lead-shot ammunition. Get the latest news and reviews from Gundigest.com. The Fora platform includes forum software by XenForo. You are also correct that the different rib styles used on Model 12's can get confusing..EG. Winchester ~ Model 12 Trap ~ Pump Action Shotgun ~ 12 Gauge. By signing up you agree to Guns.com's Winchester was bankrupt and went into receivership in January 1931. 80 of 1916 indicates seven empty 12-gauge paper shell lengths (2-1/2 to 3-1/4 inches). The Olins used the Western ammunition plant at East Alton, Illinois, as collateral for borrowing about four million in cash, no small feat in the fall of 1931. When winchester changed the chamber to 3" did they mark the barrels or reproof? Enthusiastic hunters bought the new repeater. Nickel and ivory sight beads on the aftermarket Simmons rib, with choke marked full and 2 3/4 inch chamber. Ernie Simmons of Olathe, Kansas, a gunsmithing "whiz-kid" and a fairly good skeet shooter to boot-they were involved in the later cost-saving Winchester ventilated ribs for various Winchester shotguns- Model 12's, Model 50's, possibly Model 21's-. The history of Oliver F. Winchester (1810-1880) and his endeavors in the manufacturing of fire-arm sat Bridgeport and New Haven, Connecticut, is filled with circumstances that could have led to corporate failure.
